The Engine of Intent with Duane Sharrock

[00:00:00] Speaker A: This podcast is brought to you by MHA of Dutchess county and produced by CMJW Entertainment. [00:00:06] Speaker B: You're listening to the vital women of Washington Heights. [00:00:16] Speaker C: Hello, everyone. My name is Iris Douglas. And joining me today again is my co host, Yvette o'. Sullivan. We are I and I. How you doing, girl? Are you good? I'm good. [00:00:25] Speaker B: I'm happy that you're back from your vacation. We missed you. [00:00:28] Speaker C: I know Seattle was fun, but it was definitely far and lots of work. But it was definitely a good time to get together with family and meet a new baby. So it was very exciting. [00:00:37] Speaker A: Congratulations. [00:00:38] Speaker C: Yeah, thank you. Thank you. So today we have Dwayne Shirock and we're very excited to have you. Dwayne, you are very, very special because you are very. You're my very good friend Jose's husband. So I'm happy to have you here. Yes, yes. Also worked with Yvette. [00:00:54] Speaker B: Yes, we've worked together. Thank you for coming. [00:00:57] Speaker A: Yes, thank you. [00:00:58] Speaker B: Welcome. [00:00:59] Speaker A: Thank you for thanking. [00:01:01] Speaker C: Well, you have special things going on. Dwayne is a facilitator of transformative learning, leadership and organizational growth. And we definitely want to know more about that. So. [00:01:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:01:12] Speaker B: Well, Dwayne, before we get started, I always bring a bochinje and a bochinche in the Dominican culture is kind of gossip. But what I do with it instead of gossip, I use facts and I like to educate the audience with what's happening in Dominican Republic and our culture. So I thought today it would be nice to tie in with the research that I've done on how they work with youth in Dominican Republic and the work that you're doing today. So I'm going to read my research from my show notes because I do not want to miss out on any information that I want to share with the audience. So the Dominican Republic has a program called Integral Youth. And this program is supported by the UNESCO and the Ministry of Youth. The organization efforts are focused on promoting the physical and mental health of students. Students. It promotes empowerment through quality education that is inclusive and gender sensitive, striving for safe and welcoming learning space free from violence, harassment and discrimination. So with that being said, Dwayne, can you tell us what you do? Tell us a little bit about yourself. [00:02:19] Speaker A: Okay. Well, I've been working with kids for about 30 years in various ways, working in non residential, so residential placements for boys for one point at Lincoln hall. And from there I've been working with kids in various ways in schools, teaching peer mediation skills and then which would help with violence and Disagreements and working in public schools. And one of the things that, you know, that got me here was like with many teachers we've had, you know, different teachers that I've talked to, they struggled in some way in either high school or college. And for me, it was a struggle in college and to get through the four years at my school, I feel like I barely survived it in that way. It was humbling, it was somewhat devastating. But it was also a chance to really connect with resilience. And I did get the degree and I worked with the non residential, well, the residential care with the students learning more and more about kids who are having a real tough time. And that's where I developed the passion for working with kids. Seeing, you know, in many cases kids were either truant from school or they were getting in trouble with the law, mainly because of undiagnosed disabilities. So that, that got me very interested in what are ways that we can help kids. And another thing I noticed while working, you know, in residential is that, you know, people will tend, you know, teachers included, will often look at parents and caregivers and kind of blame them. But the thing is, many of the families I've met, whether it's at Lincoln hall or in other, you know, the inner city locations or where kids are really struggling, their older brother or sister or the younger brother and sister, they're doing great in school, you know, there a lot of times they are. You know, if it was just them, you wouldn't have all these criticisms for the parents and the caregivers. You would say, wow, you know, you got, you really did a great job with that kid. So that was one of the things that I was really. I really started to question even working in residentials, why, why they have a family, a family unit, their kids, you know, some of their kids are doing fine, they're thriving, but this one kid isn't thriving and they're getting in trouble. They're the ones that the teachers and the various staff look at and say, oh no, they're here again. You know, so it's like, what is happening? Why does a good family sometimes have this student who's struggling so hard? [00:05:31] Speaker C: That's so interesting because that student would have been me. I'm just keeping it real. That student would have been me because there were so many things going on in the environment at home. [00:05:41] Speaker A: Right. [00:05:41] Speaker C: You know, I was the oldest of four, so my brother and sister, my siblings, they did very well. They excel in school, but I tend not to because I was trying to help everyone else. So do you see what I mean? So you need to learn that student. You need to understand what is it exactly the challenges they're having at home and why are their siblings doing great and they're not, you know, so, you know, it's, it's all about energy and I guess where their mental state is at as well. So that's interesting. [00:06:11] Speaker B: Well, many different factors can affect a child, even if they come from a family that is a strong, that they have a strong foundation because every child is individual. And that's one. One of the things why I became a social worker was to link that school, home environment and to get that better understanding of why some children within a family do well and other children's don't. So I command you for the 30 year career that you had and now you're taking it in a different direction and still continue to work with people and educating them. Can you tell us a little bit about what is the psychological approach or safety that you're using with the work that you're doing today? [00:06:57] Speaker A: Well, you know, it's. Yeah, that's, that's a good question. Because if you'd asked me this five years ago, I would have had a different answer about, not that my philosophy had changed, but the tools I used. And it was when I got trained in trauma informed care that a whole nother world opened up for me. You know, it's just that's been my experience. Like each thing you learn, each system, each approach, you learn all these different tools and you change the way you see things, you know, and with trauma informed care, you know, you learn that trauma isn't just something that a few people experience once in a while. Most people experience trauma. Most people experience trauma a little bit. [00:07:46] Speaker C: A lot of it. But we definitely do experience some trauma. [00:07:48] Speaker A: Yes. [00:07:49] Speaker C: And it stays within ourselves. And that's when we have problem learning and making better choices. [00:07:54] Speaker A: Yeah. You know, like people will be like, wow, you know, oh, they had a tough life. Well, I had a tough life. Well, it's not the same thing, you know, it's. It's different factors. Just like you said, there's different factors. And you have like four different areas that can support a person through trauma, you know, and one of them is community. You know, when you are, you know, involved in a church or involved with clubs in the community, you're, you're learning civic education, learning how to interact with people in the community. That's a resource, a resilience resource, you know, and another one is, you know, people will repeat this off often, I think they've forgotten. I haven't heard it as much as in the past when I was first learning about it, but it's having one person in your, in your court, on your side, you know, that one person that no matter how bad things can get, they don't see you as a bad guy. They don't. They don't. They find ways to support you. They. Something I learned working with alternative educations, like, you know, many of the students that would come to the Beta High School, which is the alternative high school. Duchess Boces. They've gotten there because of so much failure, so many bad interactions with authority figures in the school, at home, with peers. You know, they've gone through so much. And some of them, it's about an undiagnosed or untreated mental illnesses or disabilities or lagging skills where they're not quite officially considered, you know, being disabled, but they have lagging skills. They have trouble processing language, they have trouble processing instructions. What are, you know, there's the cognitive slowness that. And one of the things that I found out in my research is that our ideas that, that many educators have is that there's this average person. You know, like there's most kids are average, and then you have the outliers who are either really smart or, or, or less able. And what you find out is there is no average. Like, you could not find a person. [00:10:16] Speaker B: Thank you for saying that. Yes. [00:10:17] Speaker A: They don't, they don't embody all of these average skills. They are lacking in some things or they're strong in others, and that's what's helping them. [00:10:27] Speaker C: I find that most children like that are highly sensitive, they're very emotional, and that's why they constantly get themselves trouble. That's why they don't listen. That's why they, they want to do what they want to do. And it's, you know, it's hard. You have to learn them and be a little bit more compassionate to them. And then probably they, oh, I get it now. Because they'll listen because they'll feel that you care. That's a biggie for me. [00:10:52] Speaker B: But there's also different levels of intelligence. And you pointed that out. You know, you're not I average and somebody else more intelligent than you. It's just how you learn and how that information given to you, so you have an opportunity to receive it and take it and then use it in a certain way that it works for you and you can apply it. [00:11:14] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah, that's a, That's A big. That's a big thing that I learned, you know, that, you know, while I was in college, I learned about Howard Gardner and multiple intelligences. And that blew my mind because, wow, you know, Michael Jackson is a genius of kinesthetic intelligence. And it was like, what does that mean? What is kinesthetic intelligence? And he's like the outlier. He's the one that you look at and say, that's genius. Because he takes all kinds of dance moves. He figures them out. He, you know, moving through space, changing the way he's moving his body. I mean, over time, it can be damaging as you age, but he figured out how to do these incredible moves. And while dancing and singing, you know, and seeing that and looking at how we can apply different kinds of intelligence to how we get through life, it's like, wow, you know, he might not. Well, he never really had to excel in school. [00:12:16] Speaker C: Right. [00:12:17] Speaker A: You know, he didn't have to excel in school because from childhood, what made his whole family rich was his ability to perform. [00:12:26] Speaker C: What's his energy? His energy is his. [00:12:28] Speaker B: His. [00:12:29] Speaker C: The way. Just the way he was. [00:12:30] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:12:30] Speaker C: He wasn't. He was authentic. He wasn't fake. [00:12:33] Speaker A: Well, it's. It, you know, there was an interesting family dynamic that pushed excellence and the whole family participated, you know, and performed. So there's also that to consider. You know, there's a lot of times we have, you know, like, how you're saying, like, with the compassion, with the trauma informed care, you know, I'm going to jump on because I didn't know where I was going with the Michael Jackson thing. But with the trauma informed care, it doesn't say, just let people do what they want just because they were traumatized. It talks about empowering. It talks about giving real choice. Not endless choices, not open choices, but a few choices, you know, letting people feel like their choices matter. Because a lot of what trauma does to you, it dehumanizes you. [00:13:23] Speaker C: Absolutely agree. [00:13:25] Speaker A: Yeah. And it, it, it takes you further and further away from who you are. It shuts you down. You become more defensive, vigilant. You're trying to basically protect yourself all the time. [00:13:36] Speaker C: If you don't have that one person that's constantly saying, no, you got this, you got this. [00:13:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:13:40] Speaker C: You know, you might have that trauma and trauma go bad. So it's important that we stay focused. [00:13:45] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:13:46] Speaker C: Yeah. I have a question for you. I think you've already answered it, but I think it's important that I ask, and I don't want to forget to ask. Can you Share the moment or period when you first discovered the concept of adaptive growth and what sparkled your interests. [00:14:00] Speaker A: Adaptive growth. I. The concept itself came later. But one thing, like in my childhood, you know, I. Another, you know, you always hear about artists like, this is the art is what saved them, you know, and for me, it was drawing and writing stories because I was always into writing stories. And, you know, it's like in comic books, you know, I was. You know, people. People think that comic books were all about violence, but the violence is just, oh, wow, they're so powerful, but they're going up against something even more powerful sometimes. And the best stories are when the. The hero is. Isn't as strong as the bad guy and he needs help and being able to. Even in those moments, the comic book started showing the heroes afraid, you know, like Spider man would get scared all the time, you know, and the fact that, you know, he kept, you know, his mission, you know, the one trauma that made him decide to be a hero was his stepfather, his Uncle Ben take, you know, getting killed, you know, and that he didn't act when he could have. And that trauma, he used it to guide him in being a hero. So that. But so for me, getting those messages, I think that sometimes, you know, like getting around other comic book readers, you know, they're focusing on the powers and all that stuff. The powers are cool and they definitely keep your attention, but when they become overpowered and it could just wipe away. Wipe away anybody, I lose interest. [00:15:51] Speaker C: Exactly. You know, because there's no message. [00:15:53] Speaker A: There is no. Because the one thing, like even Superman, like Superman. I used to hate watching, you know, Superman comics because why he's, you know, nothing can beat him, you know, but. But there was a point. [00:16:06] Speaker B: But he had a weakness. Superman had a weakness, just like all humans. And I like the fact that you said, you know, talking about fear, you know, doing it afraid. And that's one of Joyce Meyer's quotes, which I, I read a lot about her and what she says. But I just love that quote, doing it afraid. Because every human being, I feel, has some kind of fear. And even though the Superman presented himself to be the ultimate strong individual, but he had a fear. And like Iris mentioned, that was kryptonite. So we all have our own kryptonite. [00:16:43] Speaker A: Right. Well, what I liked is that they scaled him down so he can get hurt. He can get hurt by magic. He can, you know, he has the kryptonite. There's a lot of different things about him. He's not all, well, at Least when I was reading, when I was interested, he wasn't all powerful. He wasn't moving planets. He wasn't. He was a guy that could. Just stronger than everybody else who had a responsibility. And, you know, in the comics, he was beaten down a lot. And he, you know, they showed that he was afraid, you know, and. And his. His father, his adoptive father, who had been through some war, actually had to talk with him about that fear. So I. I just loved that finding of resilience, finding the strength to. To do what you feel is right and achieving those goals in the comics. And they. It was. What's cool about each comic character, like, star of their comic, is that they have different ways of dealing with the world. You know, they have different lenses, they see the world, and they have different kinds of enemies that they have to fight against. And then, you know, they keep coming up with, you know, coming up against what their values are and when they need to act and when they. [00:17:53] Speaker C: They shouldn't use those tools. When to use those tools. Right. When to use those tools with integrity, too. Without cheating. Right. [00:18:01] Speaker A: Well, you know, what's interesting is that, you know, they're. They like some. Some of the characters, they don't care about that. [00:18:07] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:18:08] Speaker A: You know, they're just like, I'm stopping the bad guy, you know, whatever it takes. So I, you know, so it's. It's that whole. It's very diverse. You know, they have different kinds of heroes that focus on different kinds of things. [00:18:23] Speaker B: So, Dwayne, you speak about resiliency and safety and having that one person that you can go to and trust. Can you tell us a little bit about what are those tools or tips to prevent an individual from using violence or feeling that they're so lost that they have to bring out their anger in a very violent way without going to that one person that they trust, without feeling protected or having that safe space where they feel, you know, that they are protected themselves. [00:18:57] Speaker A: All right, well, you mentioned before about intelligence, so I'll say education build skills, you know, and one of the things that education, like, one of the trends is social emotional learning and teaching students how to, you know, some schools do more than others, some classrooms do more than others, but they teach things about restorative circles. They teach mediation skills, you know, so that you'll be able to talk more than just fight. Okay. And they have, like, so many different ways to teach or to see or reframe things that happen to you, so it. That it changes the way you react to things, which is a Big. Which is a key. It's key, you know, if, if you are a student before. What I wanted to say was, you know, without that one person, you have to feel like you have a community that shares your values. Okay. If you're the only one or if you feel like your whole community is looking down on you like you have, you're from that bad family that doesn't have, you know, success and is always in trouble, it's much harder for somebody to find that one person or to connect with people in the community when you have all that. [00:20:23] Speaker C: That's a good question. That's good. Why do you think a person like that would have a hard time finding. Do you think it's trust? When you're in such a bad situation, you don't know how to get out of. Can you trust somebody from the outside? [00:20:36] Speaker B: That's a good point. [00:20:36] Speaker A: Yeah, it is about trust, you know, that's what they teach you in trauma informed care. You need people you can trust and who will empower you. And if everybody's already biased against your whole family line, which was you in particular, you're. It's going to be hard to find it. I mean some people, regardless of that kind of situation, they do things like they find art, they write their poems. You know, they might not share them with anybody, but they, that's their sanctuary. They do their poems, they draw their pictures and you'll see them. [00:21:09] Speaker C: That's their healing. Art, music, dance. You mentioned Michael Jackson. That was his release. The dancing and the music and the creation of it, you know, and it was, it was a release for me. Yoga and dance releases any negative emotions that I had in my body. So I feel. And Prince too. You didn't miss your Prince, you know, he was a genius. [00:21:29] Speaker A: Yeah. Played all, all the instruments, all the. [00:21:33] Speaker C: Instruments that you hear, they just self taught themselves, right. [00:21:36] Speaker A: They find, they, they find something they're interested in. Again, it's that interactive thing. I mean music is a great, you know, it's great when you perform in a band. Like, you know, I had a music background so. And I played saxophone and piano and playing in the school band or singing in the chorus, you know, from those days. It teaches you so much because it's hard to remember the first days of getting the music and not knowing it and being taught how to, you know, practicing it so you could get better at playing it and then having your director trying to make sure everybody's on the right time and they're on tune. All of that stuff before the actual performance. You know, it teaches you that things come together, that they start rough, but in the end, everybody has a part to play. And when people aren't stepping up, that performance can be off, you know, and you can hear that person off key or, you know, or flat. [00:22:39] Speaker C: So how do you stay performing? Right? How do you stay, you know, with that focus and. And doing better all the time, staying with that mindset and setting those goals and just focus on those goals? [00:22:49] Speaker A: Well, you're not going to do it all the time. Okay. It's not going to happen. Okay. So that's one of those, like, normal messages that we keep getting. It's the other one saying, you got to be perfect. People pretend that computers are now these perfect tools. They fail, you know, and how many times, you know, you lose the Internet, how many times the app freezes up, how many times things go wrong with the technology? And, you know, looking at those things, you say, look, I'm flesh and blood. I'm a human being. I'm going to make mistakes. Computers are going to make mistakes. We. We have great tools. They do help us, but when we. At the worst times, we got to do a presentation, we have to do a podcast or something, and everything's set, and then something happens. The Internet's out, You know, the power goes out. You know, that's it. What do you do? But the. So how do we keep our eyes. Our eyes on the prize? How do we stay focused on our goals? It actually is a community, you know, it's like one of the things I found out is this whole idea that people can just do all these things alone. [00:24:06] Speaker C: It's not true, love, that you said that. You can't do it. [00:24:10] Speaker A: Not you. You can't. [00:24:11] Speaker C: We can't do it alone. We can. We can. Yeah. We need togetherness to do it together, support each other. [00:24:17] Speaker A: And the thing I. I was really interested in, and I'm still working out, is the idea that even the living tribe that you find sometimes you can't find that living tribe. But again, with some artists, some poets, they have their role models that they've never met. They read their books and poems. They. They read the biographies and autobiographies. They know, you know, they've watched them in their appearances, their interviews. They build a picture of that person. They want to be like. [00:24:49] Speaker C: They're visionaries. [00:24:50] Speaker A: Yes. And then you say, I want to be like this person. What would they say if I did this? So being able to even draw from that resource, an invisible being that the only real way, you know, that they exist. Is that these books come out or that you see them on a screen or in photographs in magazines, you still. These are the people that you want to be like. And, you know, you live towards them. So it's still like, how do you keep your values? Well, it's hard to stay on track, but if you know enough about somebody, who else who achieved their goals, who look like you, who had a life like yours, and see how they got through everything, you say, wow, this is. I can do this. That's what Jimmy did. I'm gonna do this, too. I'm not giving up. [00:25:39] Speaker C: Role models is very important. I agree. [00:25:42] Speaker B: So how are you using all that knowledge and background experience that you've applied when you worked in the school system, with your current work now, and going into organizations and teaching these corporate leaders to reason better or for them to use a different approach and stay humble and not be like, well, I'm the leader and their employees are beneath me. How are you incorporating all of that today? [00:26:11] Speaker A: It's a lot of stories. It's very. People learn through stories. They hear messages through stories, giving them, like, you know, different sayings, proverbs, stuff like that. You hear it, you nod, but you hear the story, it changes you. And one of the things I like to bring up, you know, especially among teachers, is that, you know, teachers, when they teach their subjects, they have become experts of their subjects. They learned the books, they learned how to criticize, they learned how to analyze. Years and years of doing that with different classes begins to make you think that it should be coming easily to, like, a student reading a book for the first time should be able to pull out all these insights from the first time they read it. And it's like, no, you have to remember your first time. Try to remember the first time you read that book. [00:27:03] Speaker B: Put yourself in that person's shoe. [00:27:04] Speaker A: It's very important for teachers to remember learning when they didn't know anything. And for me, whenever I start to feel full of myself, I remind myself, because my wife is bilingual. And I remind myself, oh, yeah, well, she said it in English. You know, I don't know. I mean, I am trying. I'm learning more and more. I'm making progress. I am. Inch by inch, I'm making progress. But. But Spanish, if you try to learn another language or try to learn something completely new, that will help you. It humbles you. And it also reminds you to be more compassionate. Because if you could find somebody who will work with you and have patience with you, you know, you're not going to sit there and say, oh, that, you know, they should know this by now or they should be able to achieve this. It's empathy. And one of the things that we fight about as we get more and more powerful is how to be empathetic. Okay. Because power and money reduces empathy. [00:28:11] Speaker C: Yes, it does. [00:28:14] Speaker B: So pretty soon we're going to be wrapping up the show. [00:28:17] Speaker A: Okay. [00:28:18] Speaker B: So in conclusion, do you want to add perhaps something that we haven't asked about that you feel that it's important for you to bring out today? [00:28:28] Speaker A: Oh, no, just. Just my book. I'm, I'm working on my book. [00:28:32] Speaker C: What's the name of your book? [00:28:35] Speaker A: Igniting the Engine of Intent. [00:28:37] Speaker B: Oh, I like that title. Tell us a little bit about it. We're both so excited. [00:28:43] Speaker A: Well, well, it, it's, it's exploring the different mind parts. You know, like, people have something that the Greeks, like Aristotle and Plato, especially Plato, split up the mind into three different parts. And, you know, and we use it in rhetoric, too. We talk. When we. We talk about appealing to somebody's emotions, you're appealing to their logical sense or you're appealing to their credibility. You know, you're using all three of those things to, to get a message out. And sometimes people are so focused on one thing, like the emotional message, but, you know, you got the emotions, but what you're promoting is very negative, you know, or. Or that, you know, like. Or you have a lot of belief in something and you've lived that life, but you don't know how to appeal to the logic of something. You know, like to be able to reason with people about why somebody should feel a certain thing or want to accomplish a certain thing. So, you know, it's, you know, it's what leadership is about. It's finding ways that connect with other people, figure out how they think and how to get. Accomplish the goals that everybody needs to accomplish. [00:30:01] Speaker C: I'm excited about that book. [00:30:02] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:30:03] Speaker C: Can't wait for it to come out because people have to understand how we work, right? [00:30:06] Speaker A: Yeah, it's always, it's always a process. [00:30:10] Speaker B: Great. Well, thank you so much for being here with us today. And we want to give a shout out to our producer and also. [00:30:17] Speaker C: Absolutely. And our sponsor, Andrew o', Grady, Mental Health America, Dutchess County. You know, thank you so much. We're here because of you, so we really appreciate it. [00:30:33] Speaker B: Speaking about community and not doing it alone and being supported by other sources. That's why we're here. The Bible women of Washington Heights Today and next week. [00:30:45] Speaker C: Next week we got a hot Latina. [00:30:47] Speaker B: We have a hot Latina coming on the show because we're going to be celebrating Hispanic Heritage Month. And she's gonna blow your mind away. [00:30:55] Speaker C: Because she's got lots to say. [00:30:57] Speaker B: She has lots to save and a lot of energy. [00:31:00] Speaker C: We're very grateful for this opportunity. So thank you. Thank you, everyone, for always, you know, linking in and just watching our show, our podcast. It's important. We're here to educate. We're here to share our experiences with you. So thank you. We, the vital women of Washington Heights in Dutchess county, thank you again, Dwayne. [00:31:15] Speaker A: Thank you. Thank you for having me. [00:31:17] Speaker B: And thank you to our audience because we cannot do it without you. [00:31:19] Speaker C: No, we cannot. [00:31:20] Speaker A: Ex. [00:31:20] Speaker C: Thank you so much, Connor. [00:31:22] Speaker A: This podcast is brought to you by MHA of Dutchess county and produced by CMJW Entertainment.